same sex naturism

[ElKhazike]

As I was looking for some naturist type things in Los Angeles I found an old fashioned russian spa that has a sauna, steam room, cold pool, full sized swimming pool, and an outdoor deck. all of which your allowed to go to in the nude except for a few days a week when it is coed. on the one hand you get to take your clothes off and spend a bunch of time relaxing in the nude, but on the other hand its males only so i guess its not true naturism.

I was wondering what your guys opinoin is on same sex opportunites to be nude and if you think its a worthwhile naturist experience.

[Wolf]

Why wouldnt it be?

[greg2phil]

yeah I agree - get into it anyway you can.  There is a similar place in Sydney - Korean Bathhouse.  All ages from children through to grandparents but it is strictly segregated.  I love going to this place in winter - it\'s warm and you can be naked!

[pat9916]

As I was looking for some naturist type things in Los Angeles I found an old fashioned russian spa that has a sauna, steam room, cold pool, full sized swimming pool, and an outdoor deck. all of which your allowed to go to in the nude except for a few days a week when it is coed. on the one hand you get to take your clothes off and spend a bunch of time relaxing in the nude, but on the other hand its males only so i guess its not true naturism.

I was wondering what your guys opinoin is on same sex opportunites to be nude and if you think its a worthwhile naturist experience.

Where in LA is it? It may be worth the drive (Provided it\'s legit).

[Disenchanted]

It\'s still naturism, even if it isn\'t coed. As long as it\'s social nudism, it\'s naturism.

[Anonymous]

As I was looking for some naturist type things in Los Angeles I found an old fashioned russian spa that has a sauna, steam room, cold pool, full sized swimming pool, and an outdoor deck. all of which your allowed to go to in the nude except for a few days a week when it is coed. on the one hand you get to take your clothes off and spend a bunch of time relaxing in the nude, but on the other hand its males only so i guess its not true naturism.

I was wondering what your guys opinoin is on same sex opportunites to be nude and if you think its a worthwhile naturist experience.

Well I don\'t know anything about spas in the Russian tradition; perhaps that has something to do with the gender-specificness of the place.

Otherwise I think it most unfortunate that they maintain the distinction -- I agree that true naturism wouldn\'t discriminate between mixed- and single-gender nudity. It\'s great that nude is accepted, but it\'s not so much different from a male locker room atmosphere.

Tradition isn\'t always right, either. Again I\'m ignorant of Russian tradition, so I can\'t judge too harshly. But it reminds me of men who don\'t want their wives to drive their sports cars, or women to join their hunting clubs, or so on. Heck, maybe I\'m wrong. But I feel that there are some unfortunate but deeply ingrained heteronormative attitudes that prevail in too many social settings.

[HarleyNude]

Hey ElKhazike

The fact that it was a Russian Sauna (more appropriately called a Russian Banya), is why it was single sex only.  Traditionally Russian Banyas are same sex only nude.  Think of it as a men\'s club...   :-)

I\'m a huge freak when it comes to saunas and hotsprings, and have learned a lot over the past few years that depending on where you go, what ethnic group a business caters to will determine the amount of nudity, co-ed use and behaviour expectations.

A great website to review for more info is here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sauna

Here in Seattle, we have a Russian banya facility called Banya5 ( http://www.banya5.com ) :-)

It is an genuinely authentic HOT Banya (temps are routinely above 180-190 F) that will provide you with an incredible experience.  Until you\'ve been whacked and beaten up with some fresh birch branches you haven\'t lived!

Our local travelling naturist group \"The SLUGS (Sun Lovers Under Grey Skies)\" [ http://www.slimetrail.org ] has started a new tradition with them over the winter to have 1 night a month as a co-ed nude naturist night.  It has been a smashing success, and hopefully we will likely get them to start coming around to doing it on a bi-weekly regular basis...

We do have a large Russian or East European immigrant community here that supports the traditional use... so they do manage to make a go of it without feeling the need to change their rules too much.  :sad:

Everyone should make an effort to attend a REAL sauna a few times.  When you go remember that you are entering into a whole different culture.  Don\'t bring your \"usual\" naturist expectations with you.

There still exists an old saying, \"saunassa ollaan kuin kirkossa,\" – you should be in the sauna as in a church.  

Cheers!

Ryan

[Wolf]

Otherwise I think it most unfortunate that they maintain the distinction -- I agree that true naturism wouldn\'t discriminate between mixed- and single-gender nudity. It\'s great that nude is accepted, but it\'s not so much different from a male locker room atmosphere.

 You make a good point here.  I guess the True test of body acceptance and the lifestyle of nudity not sex, is in the presence of both male and female. Otherwise, ya I guess it would be kind of like a locker room atmosphere.

[HarleyNude]

You make a good point here.  I guess the True test of body acceptance and the lifestyle of nudity not sex, is in the presence of both male and female. Otherwise, ya I guess it would be kind of like a locker room atmosphere.

OK guys I guess I need to interject a stronger opinion here... I thought I alluded to it in my previous post.

The TRUE test of naturism is body acceptance.  It is NOT a co-ed presence.  These Russian Banyas are doing what they deem correct.  Just because they don\'t have a co-ed experience does NOT mean they are not naturist friendly.  You are putting your American experiences of what you have been taught is \"true naturism\".  There are many flavors of naturism guys, don\'t buy into one formula.....

These places do NOT bill themselves as Nudist places of business.  They are saunas that correspond to the ethnic flavor that they are designed around.  

Can you understand where I\'m coming from?

Ryan

[Wolf]

I should have known someone would backlash my comment.

My point is that just because men in a locker room have no problem being nude while changing or showering DOESNT make them nudist nor does it mean that it is a nudist environment. I think they are mealy are following tradition more than they are supporting nudity.

 Please understand im not saying the lifestyle should be strictly co-ed, just saying in many cases of same sex nudity, its not exactly supporting a nudist lifestyle, but rather just an area where its expected (like a locker room).

[didi]

While living in Sweden I had been to both same sex and co-ed saunas, in my opinion both are leaning toward a naturist experience when compared to a locker room. My experience at locker rooms both here in South Africa, the USA and UK are generally that most guys will still try to be \"modest\" when getting dressed or taking a shower. They will wrap a towel around themselves, dash to their shower cubicle , inside they will take a shower, dry themselves and wrap a towel around themselves come out and then try to put on underwear with the towel wrapped around their waist, very funny to watch!!!  

The sauna in the locker room at my local gym isn\'t much different, the guys in there generally make sure that they have a towel tightly wrapped around their waist, whereas in Sweden Saunas we used towels or boards to sit on, no one actually kept a towel wrapped around their waist.

Of course there\'s guys who are the exception to the rule, who are extremely confident about their bodies and parade around naked in the locker rooms and it\'s accepted by the other guys since it\'s only a bunch of guys in there.

Actually I\'ve noticed that if one guy goes bare in a locker room, some of the other guys will follow suite and get rid of their towels once they realize that no ones going to judge them. I actually enjoy going into the sauna and sit on top of my towel as I always do and then strike up random conversation with the guys inside... it usually take less then two minutes for some of the others to slowly get rid of their towels... they would slowly sort of loosen their towels, then let it slide open a little bit, until eventually the towel would sort of fall open... very discreet!!! As if they where naked in there all the time.   Very funny to observe. Other times when I\'m alone in a sauna I\'ve noticed that guys who come in and see me sitting naked on-top of my towel will do the same when they sit down.

To come back to the point of same sex saunas being like locker rooms or a true nudist environment... because guys tend to generally cover up in locker rooms I don\'t think an average non nudist guy would actually freely go to a sauna club where he knows everybody inside is going to be naked, even tough it\'s same sex. Guys who would go to such a place would be comfortable enough with their bodies to be willing to be totally naked around other guys and for this reason I would say the Russian Sauna leans toward a nudist experience and not just a locker room experience. Granted a lot of the guys inside would not be comfortable with being naked around the opposite sex, but nudism comes in many forms and in my opinion nudism is the experience of being nude and not necessarily being nude around others.  :grin:

[Aymz]

i think both Wolf and Harley are not that far apart in their opinions...

i think both (and i too) would agree that naturism is defined not by the gender of the group involved but in the situation and the motivation behind the nudity.

so, for example, one can be alone in a house or flat or dorm and be practising naturism (or nudism, but i don\'t want to start up an argument about definitions), if one is nude for reasons of preference, enjoyment or comfort.  similarly, a group composed entirely of women or entirely of men can be said to be engaged in naturism if they are nude because they prefer to be so, regardless of whether they are \"testing\" body acceptance by being nude in mixed company.

for me, social naturism (of which i have only a limited experience so far) strives to be no different to any other social activity (except for the lack of clothing), in terms of men and women socialising together.  but equally, men will just as likely socialise with other men, women with other women, when clothed, so why discount same sex nude socialising as somehow different to naturism?

but... as i said, defining something as naturism rests for me on the motivation behind the nudity and the situation in which it is occuring.  so, as i sit here typing this with nothing on, i am as far as i am concerned engaged in some form of naturism, albeint a private and individual pursuit.  if i go to the swimming pool and undress in the public female-only changing room and walk over to a locker without covering myself, am i engaged in naturism?  as far as i am concerned, the answer is no.  i might be displaying a relaxed attitude to my own nudity which comes as a result of my naturist experiences, but i am nude in a place where nudity (perhaps not to the degree i am demonstrating it but certainly some nudity) is expected, required even.  practicality dictates that you remove your clothing in these situations, regardless of whether you would choose to remove it in other situations.

or to put it another way, would you consider it naturism to be nude in the shower?

so, what i\'m saying really is that, yes, naturism is naturism so long as people are choosing to be naked out of preference in a situation where nudity is not required by even mainstream society.  and that\'s regardless of whether it\'s alone, with members of the same gender or in a mixed-gender group.

but saunas, baths etc are, to me, places where being nude is required to some extent.  perhaps there are degrees of nudity, and someone who is a naturist may demonstrate a more relaxed attitude to nudity, and thus be nude more, and more openly, than someone who is not a naturist, but to be nude in a sauna is not, to me, the same thing as practising naturism - and that\'s regardless of the gender of the peopleyou are there with.

[Wolf]

Once again Amy, you make a brilliant post that (far more clearly) illustrates how i feel about it. Very well done.

[kensington25]

G\'day Greg, can you tell me more about the Korean Bathouse in Sydney as I keep meaning to go when I am there. Is it a friendly environment? Best wishes

William

[Nude_not_rude]

I have been to the Korean Bath House in Sydney. Unfortunately it\'s in Kings Cross...red light district, but as it was a week night, and the rules explicitly ban sexual behaviour, I thought it should be o.k. How wrong I was . All seemed fine to begin with, great facilities, plenty of room, friendly etc...then at about 8pm (on a weeknight) it turned into a gay love-in. I was appalled and horrified and left quicker than I thought humanly possible. Unfortunately it was yet another example of the nude = sex attitude rearing its ugly head, and the gay community wrecking yet another opportunity for non-sexual nudity in a social setting for the rest of us. I certainly will never be returning.

Just my two cents....